First minister promises to look at Welsh council powers

The Welsh government is to examine the powers councils have and how authorities work together regionally, the first minister has announced.

At a speech at Cardiff University, Rhun ap Iorwerth announced that this could lead to new legislation after the next election in 2030.

He is due to meet Prime Minister Andy Burnham, who says ministers in Cardiff should hand more powers to local authorities, later this month.

Ap Iorwerth denied offering a quid pro quo to the prime minister, who the Plaid Cymru leader is hoping will give the Cardiff government more powers and funding.

In the same speech, he also called on the UK government to stop duplicating the Welsh government's economic development work.

"Where power can sit as closely to the people it affects, it should," the first minister said at the event at Cardiff University's Glamorgan building.

"Whilst I am clear that we should never assume that what works for England will work for Wales, and vice versa - and I hope the prime minister acknowledges this – I know that our current arrangements aren't perfect either.

"I am convinced that, over time, Wales should move towards a more coherent and more streamlined system of local and regional governance.

"But that vision cannot be imposed."

Ap Iorwerth promised a green paper by the end of the term, followed by the "option" of new legislation from the next Welsh government.

He said he wanted to be in a "good position to reflect on what is working and where change is needed" by the end of the term, but said the "conversation" had to start before then.

The first minister said it would be a "detailed, meaningful exercise reflecting on where powers and specific competences should lie, how regional working works best and what effective cooperation looks like".

Rhun ap Iorwerth has previously written to the prime minister calling for Wales to have the same powers as Scotland - including on railways, policing and justice.

Asked by BBC Wales if he was trying to offer the prime minister a "quid pro quo", ap Iorwerth said: "I don't quite see it in that way.

"As somebody who wants power close to the people in Wales, I like the fact that the UK's new prime minister is talking that kind of language, but it means different things in Wales and England.

"The devolution programme that we're hearing from Andy Burnham is largely an England programme. What I want to do is find common ground with him."

The first minister questioned whether Downing Street's "devolution agenda" was "really an England-only agenda", and whether it came to a "shuddering halt at Offa's Dyke".

Economic development in Wales is devolved to the Welsh government.

But ap Iorwerth said Wales was living with a "confused" and "increasingly fragmented system".

"A succession of UK government programmes has been layered on top of devolved responsibilities and in some cases undermining them," he said.

"Some have funded worthwhile projects. Some have brought genuine benefits. But, taken together, they have made the landscape more complicated, more fragmented and more difficult to navigate."

He listed city and growth deals, and the former Conservative UK government's levelling up and shared prosperity fund projects, as examples.

"If powers have been devolved, central government should not continue to duplicate them," he said.

He called for a "practical agreement about how our two governments work together to unlock Wales' economic potential".

Asked later to clarify, he said he was not saying he wanted to get rid of city and growth deals - agreements between the UK government, Welsh government and local councils to help fund local projects - of which there are four in Wales.

"Whatever we have, lets look at what works well and how we can improve it," the first minister said.